Kalm with Kava with Morgan Smith

The scariest part of burnout is how “normal” it can start to feel, until one day it doesn’t. Morgan Smith, CEO of Kalm with Kava, shares the moment he took a prescribed benzodiazepine for anxiety and lost the rest of the day, a wake-up call that sent him searching for calmer, safer ways to regulate his nervous system.

We go deep on kava, a 3,000-year South Pacific plant tradition that most people only see as a passing wellness trend. Morgan breaks down what kava is, how traditional kava tea is prepared, what kavalactones do in the body, and why a numb tongue can be part of the experience. We also compare kava with alcohol, cannabis, and CBD, including why many people like it as an alcohol alternative that supports relaxation without the same “next day” cost.

From there, we zoom out into the bigger why: modern nervous system dysregulation. We talk capitalism, pressure to produce, and the way food and housing insecurity keep so many of us on edge. Morgan shares stories from Vanuatu, Fiji, Tonga, and Hawaii that highlight a relationship-first way of life, plus why ethical kava sourcing matters when a crop takes years to grow and shortages can ripple for seasons.

You’ll also hear simple beginner tips, how to build a nightly kava ritual that feels meditative, and why third-party lab tested kava should be non-negotiable. If you enjoy grounded holistic living, nervous system regulation, and transparent wellness education, hit play, subscribe, and share this with a friend who needs a softer landing, then leave a review and tell us what your wind-down ritual looks like.

Episode Links:

• Premium Noble Kava for the Mind & Body | Kalm with Kava
• Follow them on Instagram @kalm_with_kava
• Get to know more about kava on their YouTube @Drinkkalm

Transcript

Welcome To Modern Zen Collective

SPEAKER_01 0:09

Hi, I'm Lizzie.

SPEAKER_00 0:10

And I'm Nikki. Together we welcome you to the Modern Zen Collective Podcast, a space where we explore holistic living, spiritual alignment, and personal growth.

SPEAKER_01 0:20

Each week, we'll share conversations, practices, and wisdom to help you live with more joy, purpose, and connection.

SPEAKER_00 0:27

From ancient wisdom to modern mindfulness, we are here to help you connect, expand, and come home to yourself. Let's elevate mind, body, and spirit together. And now on to today's episode.

Soft Emergence And Today’s Guest

Anxiety, Burnout, And A New Path

SPEAKER_01 0:47

Welcome back to the Modern Zen Collective Podcast. This month we've been exploring the theme of soft emergence, recalibrating before we rise. We've talked about that strange in-between energy, the nervous system recalibration that can happen during seasonal shifts, and the importance of balance before bloom. Today's conversation feels like a beautiful extension of that. I'm joined by Morgan Smith, the CEO of Calm with Kava. Morgan has spent years working directly with Kava growers in communities across the South Pacific, developing not just a business, but a deep respect for the cultural traditions and ethical sourcing behind this plant. If you've never heard of Kava, or if you've only seen it in passing as a wellness trend, this episode is going to open you up to a much deeper perspective. We talk about what Kava actually is, how it supports the nervous system, the importance of ritual overconsumption, and what authentic plant-based relaxation can look like in a world that constantly pushes stimulation. This isn't about escape. It's about regulation, it's about presence and it's about reconnecting with practices that have supported communities for generations. So let's dive in. Awesome. Welcome, Morgan. I'm so happy to have you this morning on the Modern Zen Collective podcast. I can't wait to talk to you about the world of Kava, what it is, demystify some of these things that we see online and in social media because there's just so much information everywhere these days. Sometimes it can be hard for us to disseminate what's true, what's real, and what is kind of just someone's interpretation of things. So one our question that we love to ask everyone that we want to start off with is what defining moment really shifted everything for you and led you into this world of Kava?

SPEAKER_02 2:44

Well, first off, I'm stoked to be here. And so thank you for having me on. I really appreciate it. And um I'm kind of a cavangelist. So, you know, anytime I can talk about Kava and how cool it is and, you know, its history and how I got into it, I I, you know, relish at the chance. So thank you. Um, I first got into this because uh I was anxious and I was depressed, and I was in a spot in my life where I was working really difficult long hours. Uh, I had a a young family. My wife and I just had our second child. Um, I was um out there just uh trying to make things work, right? And uh you're in the throes of it. You told me earlier that you had some young kids as well, and um, you know, it's just stressful. And uh so I went to my doctor and I asked for some help. And um, my doctor prescribed me send densodiazepines that um, you know, uh and and and and I she said, okay, go ahead and and um, you know, whenever you feel like a panic attack setting in, take this stuff and and you know it'll it'll help kind of chill you out. So I went to my office and I was working, and a couple of days later I I ended up having, you know, the feeling like an elephant was sitting on my chest, and I took one of these pills and I don't remember what I did the rest of the day.

SPEAKER_03 4:03

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_02 4:05

Yeah, I I blacked out and it was like it was just terrifying. And so, you know, I I just thought and and the the worst part about it was I was taking coworkers to lunch, like I was driving them around, you know, I'm making decisions that I should not have been making. And so I I came too later that night and, you know, very quickly realized that that is not a solution for my life. Um, it might be for some, and I think that listening to doctors is a good idea. But um, for me, those prescriptions were a bad thing. And so uh I needed to find an alternative. And uh Kava was the one thing out of 10 or 15 things that I tried that I could really physically feel, and it didn't leave me with a bunch of negative issues as well that, you know, is associated with a lot of things that, you know, people typically associate with uh kind of chilling out and relaxing, right? So that's how I got into it.

SPEAKER_01 5:00

That's awesome. I um I feel like a lot of us in this alternative wellness space really dealt with some health issues and things like that. And we tried to to fix them in this prescriptive kind of way, and it was just a band-aid or made things worse. And that's how we had found ourselves into this holistic wellness space, this alternative wellness space. I that's actually how I ended up in this as well. I had very severe allergies and eczema my whole life, where I would wake up with blood under my fingernails and I was on low dose of steroids, steroids cream, steroid shots, special this, special that. And I just had felt uncomfortable in my body for my entire life until my mid-20s and uh finding some nutritional supplements that I was actually able to heal myself with nutrition and I don't have eczema anymore. I still have dry skin, but you know, it's it's so incredible that sometimes we need these like really major pain points for us to search out an alternative way of dealing with things rather than just having someone give something to us and being like, this will work for you.

SPEAKER_02 6:14

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's it's like a I mean, I feel like I hear that over and over again that, you know, I look like I before someone thinks like I'm some super quacky person, like my my wife is a nurse and my doctors, my my brother's a doctor, he's a surgeon, right? And so I believe in Western medicine. And so I I certainly dis don't discount what doctors do. And I and I think that there's like some really good, you know, options for a lot of people. Um, but I think what like my main message to people is that those options are not the only options to chill out, right? I think that, you know, if you look at any articles, I don't know how old you are. I'm I'm 38 and my, you know, you read every single article that's like millennials are killing this, millennials are killing that. And we're doing a really good job at killing the alcohol industry, which I'm so cool with. Like I'm I'm down. Like, let's continue to do that. You know what I mean? Like it doesn't my, you know, look, my my family heritage is a bunch of you know, Scots and and uh and uh and Welsh, you know, and we're we're out there distilling whiskey, and that did not do good for anyone, right? It's we're talking generations and generations of alcoholism and and you know, from a macro perspective, like you know, hurting economies and really hurting, you know, at the micro perspective, hurting families and and you know, my grandfather was an alcoholic, right? So I'm just saying that like there needs to be something else that we reach for that our grandpa's um, you know, screwed up, you know, and and kava might be that. It might not, you know, it might not might not be that thing, but it I think yeah.

What Kava Is And Where It Comes From

SPEAKER_01 7:51

I I really I like that a lot too. I'm 36, so we're we're right there, same same generation. So for someone who's never tried Kava before or maybe even heard of it, what is it exactly?

SPEAKER_02 8:04

Yeah, so it's a plant that's been growing throughout Polynesia, Melanesia, and Micronesia, these all these uh, you know, communities throughout the South Pacific uh for about 3,000 years. Uh it originally was a wild plant that has since been domesticated by people. So uh it is sterile, meaning that it has flowers, but it doesn't have seeds. Uh it has it has literally been for 3,000 years, people like you and me out there uh taking cuttings of like a stem, right? And so the stem is kind of like a finger, right? You take uh a cutting between the knuckle of the of the stem, and that knuckle uh is where the roots you know sprout from. And so they would do that over and over and over again to create different varieties of kava. They would take it from one island to another. It was a canoe plant, right? So they put everything, all their all the things that they owned into a canoe and all of their medicine, all their food, every all their belongings into these canoes. And obviously, if you only have so much space, you're gonna say the most important things. Well, kava was one of those most important things. That's why we have over a hundred different varieties today of plants that uh of kava plants that are all different and unique in their physical characteristics and in their uh physiological characteristics and even like taste. Uh, they all kind of taste different across the islands. Um, and so they took that plant and uh they uh, you know, grew it for a couple of years and um turned it into kind of a mash, mixed it with a little bit of water and filtered it out, and you end up having this sort of kava tea that you could drink and relax with your with your neighbor.

Kavalactones And How Kava Feels

SPEAKER_01 9:45

I love that. I was telling you before, we both have this connection to Big Island, Hawaii, which is so awesome. And uh that was where I was first introduced to kava in my early 20s. And some of the people I worked with there was like, let's go to the kava bar. And I was like, Okay, kava bar. And uh they bring out this big wooden bowl with what looks like dirt water in it and another little wooden scooper, and you scoop it in. And I was, I remember my first time trying it and experiencing that um tingling sensation on my tongue. And the, and uh, I thought that was so interesting. So, how does it, how does it work in the body?

SPEAKER_02 10:23

Yeah, so it has six major cava lactones, which are the sort of active compounds that make you feel something. Um, the major ones that most people talk about, uh, the first one is cavaine or dihydrocavaine. Those are two different cava lactones. Um, they're primarily responsible for the euphoria that kava causes. Um, and they also have a um a really interesting thing to them that most people probably wouldn't realize is uh, you know, when they drink kava for the first time, a lot of people will get a numb mouth, a numb tongue, a numb throat. And, you know, if you think of when you go to the dentist and you have to get uh a Novocaine shot to numb your mouth, well, covane has very similar features. Uh and so it will numb your mouth, it'll numb your throat. And um it's a it's a unique feeling. A lot of people drink it and they go, oh shoot, am I having like an allergical reaction? Right. I have to say, yeah, I have to make sure they know that that's coming up because they've freaked out in the past.

SPEAKER_01 11:26

I could see that.

SPEAKER_02 11:27

Yeah. Uh so those are the the two major sort of euphoric compounds. And then on the other side of that, there's a spectrum here, right? On the other side, you have um something called dihydromethysin and methicosin. So the Latin name of kava is piper methysin, and methicosin is a compound that is a sedative, and dihydromethysin is its sort of sister compound, is even more so. And so um, you know, when you talk about different kavas throughout the world, um, you know, and you look at a map, you have kava that really started in Vanuatu, which is an archipelago a couple hundred miles west of Fiji. It started out as a sedative. It's very, very strong. You know, you drink it, you want to just sit in the couch and and you know, watch a movie or something. It's it's very, very, very relaxing. Um, and then the further east you go towards, you know, Fiji, Tonga, Samoa, the Marquesas, Hawaii, um, it gets more euphoric and less sedative. So uh you end up having this sort of kind of mix of, you know, as as the canoe plant went along, they chose the plants that they liked the most, right? And that could have been for different reasons, right? Maybe one was prettier than the others, right? Maybe one was maybe it tasted better than the others, or maybe it was uh better effects, right? And we don't know what happened back then, why they made their decisions, but I can tell you that a Hawaiian variety of kava is going to be much more euphoric and less sedative than something that comes out of Onowatu. So over those 3,000 years, it I I suppose maybe 2,000 because Hawaii was was mainly populated about a thousand years ago. Um, you know, within the last 2,500 years, it it changed and more from very sedative into less sedative and more euphoric. Everything, every comma is gonna make you a little bit tired, but um yeah, it just depends on how how much so, you know, depending on the type that you pick.

Kava Versus Weed Alcohol And CBD

SPEAKER_01 13:30

Right. That's that's so interesting. I think it's it's so cool to think about how people have always been kind of playing with and tweaking the plants and the things that we interact with here on the earth. And um we do it in a different way now than they did back then. But it's so interesting that based on where you get it from, you're going to get a different kind of effects or different kinds of feelings. So that honestly, that sounds to me a little bit kind of like marijuana. I know this is different. So I'm curious how how is this different from marijuana or CBD or alcohol, you know, these other kinds of things that we were talking about a little bit earlier that we also tend to reach to, reach for that help us relax in this day and age.

SPEAKER_02 14:21

Yeah, I mean, the parallel to marijuana is quite obvious, right? You end up having these indicas and sativas and then hybrids. And uh kava is not much different. I'll say that the the main difference, though, is that it's it's much more subtle with kava. Um and it's also, you know, the the effects are like a tenth of weed, right? Like weed is like, you know, you could be in space. Yeah. That's not really gonna happen with kava. You know, you're still gonna make good decisions. Uh, you know, you're not gonna, you know, you're still gonna remember what happened last night, that, you know, you couldn't say the same with alcohol necessarily. You're not gonna get a hangover. Um, you know, and I think that the number one benefit for me is that um there's no physical tolerance. So you can have the exact same amount for three years straight and the next day wake up and not have withdrawals. You can't really say the same about anything else. It just is not like that. Especially something that's actually psychoactive, something you can actually feel. Um, so that and and also because of that, you also can't overdose on kava. It's not something that exists. Uh, it has a built-in mechanism where if you just drink too much, you get a little bit nauseous. And so your body's just like, I don't want this anymore. And you just don't drink it. So you can't even really, you know, chase the dragon like you could other things.

unknown 15:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:45

Yeah. That's that's so interesting. I uh I I really like that. I like that the tolerance thing doesn't change because I think that's a big thing that we experience now. Well, we need more to feel the same effects. Oh, we need more when it's something we do regularly. And that can just get take us to this level that sometimes we never even wanted to be at. And all of a sudden we're there and we're like, oh my gosh, look at how much I'm smoking, look at how much I'm taking, just to feel the effects that I felt a year ago or a couple months ago or whatever it is, especially when we're using it as such a a tool to help us relax at the end of the night. I know that when I got into the corporate world when I ended up back on the mainland, it was I had a really hard time for a couple years winding down at the end of the night. And I never even thought to try Kava. It was like something that I tried on the island. And it wasn't something back then I felt like that was readily available, you know, anywhere else where I could even trust it, you know. Um, so I it's such a it's such an interesting thing to think about it as something that isn't just out there on the islands or out there as something we do when we go vacation or visit something, but now we can actually bring it home with us and use it in as a healthier alternative and a way for us to actually take the edge off at the end of the day, help us to relax, help us to help us with our anxiety or or whatever kinds of things we're dealing with in that way.

SPEAKER_02 17:22

Yeah, I I mean, I do think that like it's really important to note that I, you know, look, I I have kava most nights. I I really enjoy kava, but I do think that there's something, you know, when when people reach toward towards a substance and they go, okay, well, why, why are you actually doing that? Like what is what is the thing that's bringing you to drink alcohol? What is the thing that's bringing you to smoke a joint? What is the, you know, what is that sort of mechanism? And I I think that it's very important to note that to me, kava is just like a piece of that wellness puzzle you were talking about earlier. You you have all sorts of different sort of things that you dealt with um in order to get rid of your eczema and your allergies. And you had like all sorts of, I'm sure you went through a thousand different things to try to get to where you are. And to me, having a good sort of mental place to be, kava was a piece of the puzzle, but it was never the solution, right? Um, and I want to make sure that people understand that. I the thing that I I really worry about every single day is when people hear something like this, they go, oh, well, Kava's gonna be the thing that fixes me. And it is not. Kava will not fix you. Kava is something that could help you wind down at the end of the day. It's something that's going to like, you know, help you chill out. But the thing that's going to fix you is inside. And when you have uh, you know, when when I have a difficult day, and I have many difficult days, I still have anxiety every day, I still struggle with stress, I still struggle with all these things. I go for a walk, right? I I go talk to my my my wife, I, I go play some video games with my son, you know. I I do all of these things or or meditate, right? I do all these things that really help me sort of kind of center myself and help to kind of like distract myself from what's going on. And then Kava can be a part of that, right? It can be like, okay, well, now that I've sort of dealt with some of that, the Kava can kind of like take that extra little 10% and just kind of wind it down a little bit. And so I just wanted to make sure that people understand it. Like this isn't the solution, but it is something that kind of might fit in with lifestyle changes that come along with changing, you know, how we look at substances that we're taking into our body.

Why So Many Nervous Systems Are Fried

SPEAKER_01 19:49

I appreciate you saying that. Absolutely. I think that's a very important message. I'm curious, why do you think so many people in like our day and age are so dysregulated and their nervous systems are just not, you know, in that, in that balanced state?

SPEAKER_02 20:06

I mean, we're we're living like these crazy lives, man. I mean, we're we're you know, we're living this capitalist society where we, you know, it's it's dog eat dog and it's just gnarly. It is just gnarly. I I I visit the islands often, right? So we talked about Hawaii, right? Uh I visit Vanuatu regularly. Um, next month I'm going to Fiji and I'm going to Tonga. And um, you know, they just have such a different way of life and a different way of looking at things that we really need to understand more. Um we're so obsessed with money. And the reason that we're obsessed with money is because our society has made us require it so much, right? Let's take money out of the equation, right? Like let's take us, let's take us 2,000 years ago. We're sitting on the on the plains of South Dakota or something. We're we're out there doing our thing. What's important to us? What what's what's actually important to our ancestors? Um, I'll tell you what was important. What was important was shelter and food and family. That was it. That was all that it was. And um, you know, when you sort of take that stuff away, a lot of people have gone, well, I don't I don't want a family, right? It's too expensive to have a family. Or um I've I had a difficult childhood, I had some traumas, and I don't want to kind of relive that or recreate that for my own children. Totally understandable. I'm not here to make a judgment call. All I'm saying is that your ancestors, they had families and they treated you know things differently, right? Uh or, you know, when when you talk about like food, well, right now we have a lot of people have difficult times just buying groceries, and that's terrible. And then they of course have difficulties with shelters, right? We have we have We have we have a housing crisis going on, right? So I think that's why. We, you know, the the three things that are the things that have been constant in our human existence are being questioned. And that's uh I think that's why.

SPEAKER_01 22:15

Yeah, I I would agree with that. I think when I lived out in Hawaii, I was perfectly okay with not having anything to do with anything else in the whole world. I was like, this is just living, waking up with the sun, going to bed with the sun, living in the present moment, being outside all day, connecting with other people, that whole Hawaiian time, like everything slows down out there. You know, it's 35 miles an hour mostly around there. And it's so funny. I remember when I first moved back to the mainland and I'd be like, yeah, I'm coming over. And I'd be walking out and I'd see my mom and I'd end up talking to my mom for an hour before, and I get a text and they're like, Where are you? And I'm like, Don't worry, I'm coming. You know, like I'm I'm coming. And it would be sometimes it'd be an hour and a half later than when I said I would be there because when you're out in that environment with that culture, it's just like things move slower. You just go with, oh, you see someone you meet, you spend time talking with them. You know, oh, you found a beautiful tree to lay under. You just lay under it for a little bit, you know, and it was it's like a different way of moving through your days where it's that's all it's about. It's about connection to Mother Nature, connection to yourself, connection to others, and just living in this way. It was, it was so incredible. And I think that's why I dream about it so much is we don't have, I didn't have all the stressors like we do here back in the mainland on this cap in this capitalistic society, like you're saying, and all this pressure to produce. And how how much is your production worth? How much is it worth to other people on the open market? And it might even be something that is so needed, but it's not valued in this way where you get that return, that monetary return, that energy exchange that we have here is is money, you know, and I've the the rising prices of food and stuff, it's absolutely insane. And we're having to do so much work to try and offset that with our food banks, with, you know, trying to create these um organic farms in the city in these food deserts where people don't even have access to things that are grown out of the ground. And it's it's sad. It's it's hard. And so I love that you're kind of bringing it back to that.

SPEAKER_02 24:47

Yeah. I mean, you dude, like the fact that we can't even, and so many people don't even have access to a plot of land that they could grow food on in, even if they wanted to, right? It's it's actually bonkers. Now, I I completely understand modern society, our population boom over the last hundred years. There's not, there's not enough land. You know, land is a finite resource. You cannot have everyone grow on their own food anymore. It's just not going to happen, especially with the urban densities that we have today. Um, but I will say that when you go to a place like Vanuatu, let me give you a story. This will this will illustrate it perfectly. Vanuatu, they use kava like a bank account. They have 10 plants in their backyard. And when they want to um pay for their kids' school, or maybe when they want to pay for some building materials, they'll they'll pull up some of their kava plants and they'll sell them. That's it. They grow all the rest of their food. They have pigs in the in the fenced area behind their house, too, and they have everything that they kind of want. Um I went to uh this little tiny village um in the middle of this super remote island, middle of nowhere, like national geographic kind of stuff. And um, this guy showed me his kava field, and it was one of his six kava fields. And so they had kava takes a couple of years to grow. It takes at minimum three years, but ideally five or six years in the ground before you pull it up out of the ground. And so he was showing me this field of of I think three-year-old kava. And I'd never been before. We didn't have a relationship, and I I was complimenting him. I was wow, these are beautiful plants, and what a what a beautiful field do you have here? This must have taken a lot of work. And and I was joking around, I said, Can I buy your kava? And he just looked me dead in the face and he goes, No. Like anyone here, right, that like, you know, if if you looked at their garden, you were like, wow, those are some nice tomatoes, can I buy them? They'd be like, Well, how much? You know, yeah. There, it's a completely different story. They're like, no, I I literally have everything that I need. And the only reason I'd sell you these plants is if I needed something for my family. Right. And so that's just kind of how it is. Like they live a subsistence lifestyle. They're able to kind of deal with the day-to-day life because they grow it all. They don't, they don't need me. You know, they're just kind of like, ah, I'm good. You know, uh, I I I wish we could all get back to that.

Kava Traditions Across The Islands

SPEAKER_01 27:32

Yeah, that would that would be incredible. It's I love that you're sharing some stories about this because you've spent so many years working directly with these growers in communities all over the South Pacific. So I'm curious, like, what does this authentic kava tradition actually look like in these places? And why does this ethical sourcing matter so much right now?

SPEAKER_02 27:58

Yeah. So first thing that I want to say is that I'm a white guy, right? Like I think that's pretty obvious. Right. Like I'm not an islander. I I, you know, my my ancestors came from a different set of isles and uh they were they're pretty good at exploring the world and kind of, you know, setting up new places around the world, right? So that's my background. So I I certainly can't speak for islanders or islander communities. Uh, but what I can say is that when I went out and visited, or when I currently do visit uh all these folks, and I talk to them regularly, and we've been working with the same folks for, you know, 10, 12 years, um, you know, I I've I get to know them pretty well, right? Um, and uh every single one of those cultures throughout the South Pacific is very different, right? Different languages, different um ideas uh uh for value systems, they uh appreciate um families maybe in different ways, they appreciate marriage in different ways, they appreciate um, you know, all sorts of different things, very different ways. And so kava is no different. Um, some of the cultures, they treat kava a little bit more of a commodity than others, right? Some of them treat it much more recreationally than others, some of them treat it more ceremonially, uh ceremonially than others. Um, and so uh uh so I'll give you an example of what that difference might be when it how it relates to kava. Um in Vanuatu, they take kava that's in the in the ground, that is totally green, it hasn't been processed, it hasn't been dried. You know, today in you know, like I I sell dried kava. Uh kava's been dried for maybe only 300 years or something like that. Prior to that, most everything was was consumed green. It was not dried. Um currently in Vanuatu, they still drink uh green kava. In Hawaii, for the most part, they're drinking green, not dried kava. Um and uh and uh in Vanuatu, they'll take um oh, I wish I had it with me right now, but they'll uh there's an island called Pentecost. And on Pentecost they have uh coral, pieces of coral, and they take that coral and they basically use it as like a little bit of a hand grinder. They take a piece of hibiscus bark and they'll put that in one hand, they'll put the kava root in in that as well, and then they'll take this coral and they'll grind into the hibiscus bark the um the kava roots. And from that, they add a little bit of water, and that's how they they make their kava. And they they make one shell or like a coconut shell's worth of kava at a time. And when they drink it, it's super strong. They'll drink like three or four, maybe five coconut shells worth, but it's really intense and um it's it's super, super concentrated. Now, if you contrast that with other cultures, like today, if you go to Tonga, uh, they will drink dried powdered kava and they will drink it all night long. Uh I went to some Tongans uh uh events here in Phoenix and I I showed up at like six or seven o'clock because they told me to, but unfortunately they're still on island time and I'm not on island time because I I didn't I didn't learn that yet. And so I was a little too early. Um but I uh so I I so I was there from like seven o'clock and and I I was there until 3 a.m. Oh my gosh. I left at 3 a.m. thinking surely they're gonna wind down soon. No, no, I texted my buddy the day after at about 10 o'clock in the morning. I'd woke up and said, Hey man, that was a great night. Thanks for inviting me. And he sends me a text back, it was a picture. He was still there hanging out with his buddies. They go, Oh, yeah, we're about to make some fry bread. You know, they they drink cobble very like diluted and over a long period of time so they can kind of hang out with their buddies, right? So that's the difference, right? You have you have some cultures that that makes it very concentrated and just have a little bit and then they go to sleep. And then you have some cultures that drink it uh diluted and they'll drink it for extended periods of time so they can hang out with their friends.

SPEAKER_01 32:05

That's that's awesome. That's so that's such a different those are like so different ways of using it. That's so cool that you got to go to an event like that back here, you know. Um that's that's so wild. I don't think that I'm my body could last all night anymore. I'm too old for that now.

SPEAKER_02 32:23

Oh, I can't do it either. That's why I left.

SPEAKER_01 32:26

We can't hang. Sorry, we can't hang.

SPEAKER_02 32:28

No, I'm not built like that anymore. Maybe when I was like 20.

SPEAKER_01 32:33

Yeah, yeah. We're we're we're past that. We're past there was something I feel like as soon as we turn 30, like our bodies just react different to things. It was like you hit 30, oh yeah, and we're just different. We're just different now.

SPEAKER_02 32:47

Yeah, yeah, a thousand percent. Man, I I wish I could do that again. No way, no way.

Ethical Sourcing And The Kava Shortage

SPEAKER_01 33:01

As we move into the spring equinox, a season of balance, renewal, and new beginnings, we want to invite you into a deeper layer of this work. Modern Zenco Plus has become such a nourishing space full of exclusive interviews, guided practices, channeled insights, and honest no BS bonus conversations that support real-life integration. For just$4 a month, it's a gentle way to enter your inner world, especially as things begin to check and open up again. If you're feeling called to plant new intentions and deepen your connection with season, we'd love to welcome you into this growing circle. You can find the link in the show notes. Thank you so much for supporting this work and stepping into this next season with Nikki and I. See you in there. Yeah, I'm totally with you on that. So I know um you are the CEO of Calm with Kava, and it's very important, you know, you have these relationships developed all across the South Pacific with all these growers, like directly with growers and stuff. And it's so important to not only have those relationships, but be able to ethically source where this is something that can be done long term instead of kind of like we're taking kind of like what you're talking about when you're like, oh, can we buy some? You know, typically here we'd be like, well, I'm gonna buy it all. So just give me like that wholesale price, give me that best price, because I'm just gonna buy all the six fields and we'll call it a day, you know. Why is it so important to have these relationships and source this in a way where it can be an eternal kind of thing? And how do you do that?

SPEAKER_02 34:47

Hmm. Uh it's harder said than done, right? Uh, I mentioned that we've been working with the same people for 10, 12 years. And they, you know, they they know that kava takes a couple of years to grow, right? It's not like a potato where you can just put it in the ground and eight months later you have another potato. Uh, you know, that we're talking years here, right? So um I don't know about you, but you know, if you're selling Legos, do you really know how many Legos you're gonna sell in three years? You just don't, right? But if if you need some more Legos, you can go to the Lego shop and you know, print out some plastic stuff and you're good. With Kava, it's a it's a time thing. It's a I plant it now. I hope that it goes well. I hope that there's no hurricanes that comes along. Uh, I hope that you know I can I can you know withstand any droughts that come along, you know. I I don't have irrigation. I'm in the middle of Fiji. What are you talking about? You don't I don't even know what a pesticide is, right? I have like all of these issues that are coming along that could potentially kill those plants over the course of its life growing. And like I mentioned, many communities prefer to wait until about five years until they pull up their kava. So how is someone supposed to understand how much demand for kava there will be in five years? Yeah. Um, right now we're actually in the middle of a kava shortage. It's probably the worst one I've ever seen. Uh actually, it's not probably, it is, it is the worst one. Um, and it's stemming because of COVID. Back when COVID was going on, the demand for kava was relatively high. Um, but you know, the islands, they were completely cut off. They just completely shut down all their ports. They were doing their own thing. And they had no tourists coming in and um they weren't planting kava. And so if you're waiting four or five years for kava, well, four or five years ago, that was COVID. Uh and so, you know, we we've we've kind of come to that point now where people are struggling to find the types of kava that that they prefer. Um, and so, you know, it's kind of a wake-up call for a lot of people right now, where they're they're planting as much kava as they possibly can because they did not anticipate that. And so the sustainability of it is in question. Um, we did start the farm in Hawaii as a way to sort of, well, there's a there's a couple of missions there. I think the first mission is that um I want to make sure that we preserve Hawaiian cultivars of kava. Uh they call it Ava. And um, Ava has 13 varieties of it, and uh it is not very well known. It is not very well cultivated, there's not a lot of people that grow it. Um, there are plenty of people that grow it, but there's nothing at scale that to me would preserve it for a long time. And so that's number one. I want to propagate ABA and I want to make sure that everyone has access to those cuttings. Um, and so I think that that same kind of mission is happening all throughout the islands where people throughout Fiji and Tonga, Samoa, Vanuatu, they're doing the same kind of thing. They're planting as much as they possibly can because they're seeing now what happened five years ago when they stopped planting. Uh and um, and so that that's that's the number one thing is that like those relationships, it's it's up to me to help communicate to the suppliers, hey, this is what's coming on. This is what I think is gonna happen in five years. You you need to plant as much as humanly possible, right? And we've been saying that forever, but we kind of talked earlier as well about how you know their value system is different and money is not the end all be all for them. And so while they know that, you know, they should probably plant more kava, it's you know, it's not necessarily something that's gonna affect them today. Uh and so it's it is difficult. It's difficult. Um, but I think that having those relationships is really important because without them, you just can't well, you can't be in business. Uh relationships work different over there. Uh and you you can't uh you know, you can't just go bottom dollar. You you cannot just say, hey, I'm not gonna, you know, I I uh I oh you're too expensive. I'm gonna go to someone else. Well, if you do that today in a shortage, you're not getting any kava because the people that have a the relationships are getting the kava right now. So you have to treat people right and you have to pay good money for good kava. Otherwise, the business itself is just not gonna work. You have to have some sort of integrity and you have to have to have some sort of relationship with them to to continue to get kava in shortages like this. And you also have to have the relationship to make sure that future issues like we're having today are are fixed.

SPEAKER_01 39:54

Yeah, I love that you say integrity because I think that's what's missing from so many different aspects of our culture today, like in business. It's I was in transportation and logistics for eight years and I just kind of fell into it uh when I moved to Texas. And um that was such a cutthroat, unloyal industry where if I would work my ass off for these customers for people, and if I if somebody underbid me by 50 bucks, I wasn't getting it. Even though I provided a better service, you know, I did all these things. Well, I don't know that I can't say that, you know, but I felt like that it wasn't worth it. Like it wasn't, oh, you're not worth that extra extra$50 that somebody in the office isn't even blinking about, you know. And here to me, it's like a large percentage of margin, possibly, that I'm not, oh, it's a volume play. Oh, it's a volume play. You got to do it cheaper because we're gonna funnel more to you. You know, I'm like, where is like where is that integrity? I really love that you spoke to that because it is something that we need to get back to in business. You know, we need to we do business with people that we know, like, and trust. And we need to, we need to grow those relationships and be loyal to each other and be honest with each other, you know, and we need to stand up and and fight for people when when we need to, when we need to explain to someone who's sitting in a corner office that has no freaking clue what's you know, happening five levels down. Like, we have to have the the guts and you know, to be like, no, this person, look at what they've done for us, look at all this. Like, this is a very important relationship. Like you're saying, like, this isn't about cheapening anything. We need to give them what they're worth. We need to give them what this is worth. And who are you to say that they're worth less when when you don't know?

SPEAKER_02 41:58

Yeah. Yeah. No, I I I I a thousand percent agree. Um, you know, it, it's, it's, uh, it's, it's a really strange industry to be in. Uh, a lot of people would probably have a difficult time with it because it is so um relationship oriented that it, you know, if you don't have that, it's just not gonna work. Um, I had a a conversation about a month ago with with one of our suppliers, and I said, um, they said, hey, we're gonna have to raise the the price. And and I said, and I I didn't respond for a a day or two because I was busy with other things and um I just forgot. And they they they came to me and said, Hey, uh, are are you okay? Like, are are you are you trying to find some other people? And I was like, I've been working with you for like 10 years. Like, I'm not gonna go find someone else because you have to raise the price two bucks. Like, this is fine. We're okay. Like, we're gonna figure it out. I'm not worried about it. Um, but without being like that, you you know, you you just I don't know, man. Like I I I I I have, you know, look, like I I was having dinner with my family uh a couple months back, and I I had a one of them call me from Fiji. It was a video call, and she goes, uh she goes, Oh, hey, how's it going? I said, I'm just having dinner with my family, and I, you know, I showed her my kids. And I've been to Fiji and I've had dinner with her kids, and you know, I've I've I've hung out with them. Like, how much of a jerk would I have to be to be like, nah, you're uh you're too expensive. You know what I mean? Like uh at this point, they're family. They're like people that I know, they're people that I call friends. Like I can't, I can't, I can't tell them no. Like, I you know what I mean? Like, so it it does that does make it difficult, right? Because you, you know, it sometimes you're like Oh gosh, I could get a much better price elsewhere. But at the same time, it's like that's what makes this company what it is. You know? It's uh yeah.

Hawaii Farm Legacy And Food Security

SPEAKER_01 44:09

I love that. I love that so much. I you mentioned your farm in Hawaii, and you said that, you know, you have that, you spoke about one of your missions. Are there other missions aspects to your farm? Or I'd love to I'd love for you to share a little bit more about how that got started, you know, what you kind of do there, and just share a little bit more about that. Because I I'm really curious myself.

SPEAKER_02 44:34

Yeah. Uh so Calm with Kava was started by my good friend Mike Monsell. And uh he and his wife, Tiffany, they went to uh Fiji on their honeymoon in 2009. And Mike fell in love with Kava. Tiffany, not so much. Uh she uh yeah, so they they went back to you know their their home in Montana and he tried to find Kava and he couldn't find any good Kava. Back then there was there was kind of the Wild West. It was just such a new and burgeoning industry that he just had, you know, there's just wasn't much out there. And so he um he started Calm with Kava and he started importing Kava and I became very good friends with him and I started importing Kava or I I started a uh a Kava company as well and um started working with him very closely and uh I ended up selling my company to him and we started working on a lot of different projects together and he would come down to uh Phoenix where I live and um you know we'd have boys' night in and we'd have some some kava and hung out with the kids and and the ladies would go and have ladies' night and um uh it was just a great relationship. And then in uh 2020, Mike passed away, and uh it was just like it was just the worst. He was just such a good friend of mine, and um he, you know, he was kind of my kava guru. He was the guy that I would go to and I'd ask all sorts of questions about the plant, about the people, about the culture, about this and that. And he always knew everything. And so he was just kind of like my guy, right? And um uh he in 2017, 2016, he bought a plot of land in Hawaii and uh it was five acres and he planted 200 plants, uh kava plants. And it's hard to find uh Ava in Hawaii. Uh uh, like I mentioned, you have to get cuttings, you have to know someone that has the cuttings in order to make the plant. You can't just buy seeds from anyone. So it was a difficult thing to just get 200 plants. Uh, and so when he passed away, that plot of land went into disrepair. A lot of those plants died, some of them were stolen. Um, and by the time I got to them, uh I I purchased those those plants, there was a hundred left and um little little under a hundred left. And uh so we bought some more land and then started to propagate all of Mike's original plants. Uh and so now from Mike's, you know, hundred plants, we now have about 15,000 plants.

SPEAKER_04 47:04

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_02 47:06

Yeah. And so they all the the cool part about it is that whenever you go into a kava ceremony throughout the South Pacific, one of the very first things that they talk about is honoring the ancestors that came before. They honor the people that brought us here and they honor the people that brought us kava. Uh, and so to me, Mike is now one of those ancestors. Uh, his blood, sweat, and tears that went into the field uh are now in those plants that we currently have today. So Mike is legitimately a part of those 15,000 plants that we have. And um and so that's that's how the farm started was because Mike did that. Um some of the so I mentioned that the current, you know, one of the current goals is that we propagate as much Ava as we possibly can. Um one of the uh uh another goal that we have there is that, you know, food security is a big problem on the island. Um, you know, Hawaii has a has a big problem with with food because they import basically everything. It's something like 90% of their food is imported. Uh and one crazy thing that happens today is they'll grow something on the island. Obviously, you know, it's beautiful. It's got perfect soil, it's got amazing, you know, year-round temperatures. You can grow anything there. Things grow like weeds there, you know. Uh, and um, you know, you'll see like strawberries are being grown and they get shipped off to California, they get packaged up in a pretty little package and they get shipped back to Hawaii and people buy it. Uh it it rises the food cost and it creates a system that is dependent on something that does not need to be there. It's crazy.

SPEAKER_01 48:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 48:50

Uh, you know, you're talking about, you know, families that are trying to survive, and that's just not how to do it. So uh we're also farming taro, which is kind of like a like a uh South Pacific potato, right? It's a starch that they've been using it to pound poi for forever in Hawaii, right? Uh we also grow lychee, uh, we grow sugar cane, uh, we grow bananas, uh, we grow all sorts of random little things that we're trying to figure out like the best way to do it. But really, we just want to contribute to the food system somehow, right? And um I'm not a farmer, so I'm relying on people that like know what they're doing to figure out what that exactly should be. But we know tarot is definitely in in the mix there for large scale production. Um, that's what that's one of the other kind of things with that farmers that we just want to make sure that we're like, we're we're net positive, right? Employing people, preserving Ava, and then contributing to the food situation there.

SPEAKER_01 49:50

Yeah, I remember everything like grown, not flown. You know, what do you buy that's been grown on the island, not flown in? Uh, I barely ate any bread, you know, when I was there. I barely had, you know, rice, pastas, like any of those processed kinds of things. I remember going to the local farmer's market in Hilo, and I would spend$80 and I would just have so much fresh produce, fresh salsas, fresh this, fresh that. And it was, I was making everything from scratch. I was making pizza from scratch back then, you know, uh back on the island. And I just, I miss that so much because which it's so true. Like the, for those of you who've never been to Big Island, it has 11 of the different 13 climate zones on the one island. So you can literally go to a different elevation, a different place on the island and get something different. And living in Hilo with the rain every day, I mean, it would, it's insane how quickly things grew. I had, I was lucky enough, like I was telling you, I worked at a horticultural therapy program. So we actually lived in gardens with our students. And I learned, I had never really been a gardener before that, and I learned land work from the ground up, you know, with the OO bar out there, like pounding the rocks, you know, and building all our raised bed and composting everything. I mean, it was all about like re-recycling, turning the excess into something that's so fresh and fertile to grow more. And it was such a special time in my life because I don't feel like I ever would have gotten that experience or understood what it means to actually live and cultivate the land like that and be able to then eat that and share that with others. We had this incredible avocado tree right outside of our front door of our little cottage. And most of the time we slept with the door open, just the screen door closed, and we slept in the living room on a futon because it was just like it was just magical, you know, kind of being so close to everything, tin roof, you know, listening to the rain and little kokie frogs outside. And this avocado tree, I swear, had the biggest avocados I've ever seen in my life. They were like the size of my head and they were purple. And I remember the first time we've heard them dropping from the tree. It was like this big thud and then like shh shh rolling down the hill. And we're like, what is that? What is that? And there are these massive avocados. I mean, they were so big. They were like three or four avocados here put together. And my husband and I were just boyfriend, girlfriend at the time. He was, you know, I was working a lot. He kind of just came with me. I was like, You want to move to Hawaii with me? He was like, Yeah, let's go. So he um he did tour guides um from the from the ports. He would pick people up and do van tours and things. And he was going to the University of Hilo just to like get some classes. He took this awesome astronomy class, you know, where else in the world would you get something so incredible like that? Like on that island. And he we had so many avocados. He would bring bags with him to classes and just like hand give them out to people. And that's how he would make friends and relationships. And and it was, it's like such a cool, such a cool thing. And I just remember that so vividly. I and we'll never look at avocados the same as when, you know, when we were there. I'm like, wow, such a special thing. And also to be able to share, like you're saying, share that with the other people around us. And it's really, it's really just about having those relationships and being like, look, what I have all of this. Why don't you have some? You know, here, have this. You don't need to pay for it. I just want you to have it. Because I'm not gonna be able to eat all this. I'm not gonna be able to consume all this, and I want you to have it as well.

SPEAKER_02 53:43

Yeah. I mean, it's it's a it's a different way of of life, but it's uh it's a really beautiful way of of doing things. And um it's you can't really, you know, you can't really uh understand it unless you see it and live it. And um and you have, you know, and and that's that's that's really wild. Uh not a lot of people really understand it. They just think that Hawaii is some paradise that is uh is beaches and and that's not Hawaii to me. Right. Me neither. Uh to Hawaii to me is a lot more about the actual land, and it's about the people, and it's about the culture, and it's about the way of life. It's about taking care of that land, it's about like really understanding where it came from and where it's like, you know, the the wrongs that have been done to it and the rights that we can do to, you know, fix it. And um, that's that's Hawaii to me.

SPEAKER_01 54:37

I love that. And I also wanted to say I I really appreciate you sharing about your friend Michael and everything, because I I've I physically felt that in my body when you were talking about him becoming like a part of everything that you do now. You know, his blood, sweat, and tears and him starting it and cultivating it. And now look at what has grown with your tender, loving care because of the relationship you had with him and now his legacy that is going to affect future generations forever.

SPEAKER_02 55:12

Yeah, I I I certainly hope so. Uh I mean, he he made he made a huge uh obvious uh effect on me. And um, you know, he I I have a picture of him hung up in my office at at the office at right now in the home. But, you know, he's kind of like at the heart of of pretty much everything I do. He's uh uh I I I got a picture of him here, right? Um I you know, he's always kind of around. And um uh not a day goes by where I don't think about him because uh I'm you know, I I actually I used to tell him that um, you know, after I sold my my Kava company to him, I always told him, I'm never gonna get back in this industry unless it's with you. And uh unfortunately I'm not with him, you know, but in a way I am, uh, you know, uh, but I feel like I can at least um, you know, just continue what his original vision was. Um, you know, I just knew that like when he passed away, I have all these relationships throughout the islands. Excuse me, he had all these relationships throughout the islands. And without his involvement in that business, we're talking about thousands of people that would have a difficult time selling their kava. That means that they couldn't afford to send their kids to school. That means that they couldn't afford to buy their kids school uniforms, that means that they couldn't improve their lives with building materials. That means that they couldn't, you know, that people here in the US couldn't find kava, that people didn't know about it, that people didn't know how to find good kava. And to me, all of that was really important. And so um, you know, everything that I do is is, you know, with with this guy in mind because he, you know, he started it all. Wasn't me.

Who Kava Is For And Beginner Tips

SPEAKER_01 57:01

Yeah, I love that. What a special legacy, what a special relationship, what a special purpose and path that you've found over these years and have been able to keep everything, everything moving forward and these relationships just deepening them over time. It's it's really incredible. It's really incredible. So I really appreciate you coming on today and and sharing all this with us because this is this is really this is a really wonderful conversation. And just the way that we got connected and everything, sometimes you know you're sifting through all this stuff and you got to see like what speaks to me, you know, what is my intuition telling me who's the right person for me to connect with right now? And very clearly, you you are one of those people. So thank you again. Thank you. But um I appreciate it. Yeah, yeah. I really I'm really excited about this. And um, I do want to bring it back a little bit to maybe uh who exactly would you say kava is for? Maybe who should avoid it? What's like a good beginner-friendly way for people to try it?

SPEAKER_02 58:15

Yeah, so I think that traditional kava, where you take the kava, you put it into a strainer bag, you add water to it, and you make some so some sort of a tea with it. That is the way to do it. It's it's the way it's been done for thousands of years. And if it's if it ain't broke, don't fix it. You know, you and uh I think that when people try kava for the first time, do it with a friend. I mean, it's a great time to like be like, hey, dude, I haven't seen you in a couple weeks. I hope you're cool. Uh you want to come over and hang out with me and try this muddy dirt water? It numbs your mouth and it's really like weird. I've never had it before, but you know, it's it's a neat experience to do with someone else, right? It's a really great way to connect with people. It's a really great way to learn more about one another. It helps kind of reduce a lot of that kind of social weirdness without any sort of like it doesn't lower your inhibitions or anything, but it does just kind of help lubricate the conversation. And so if you know, if if you're looking to to become closer with with someone else, if you're looking to um, you know, establish a new relationship or something like that, I think that kava is just something that can help a lot of people um, you know, kind of connect with one another. And there's no greater time to connect with one another than than a time where your tight taste buds are assaulted by muddy medicinal water. Uh so I would say that kava is for anyone that wants to um, you know, sort of live a different life, right? Someone who is uh who might not want to reach for the usual bottle, uh, someone who who wants to relax without going to the usual thing. Um, and um, I think that's the majority of people. At least try it, see if it works. It might not, it might not be the thing for you, and that's okay. But it'll be fun trying it.

Turning Kava Into A Night Ritual

SPEAKER_01 1:00:10

Yeah, I always think like, what's the harm in just trying something new? You know, exactly. It may work or it may not. It's always like, why not just ask the question? They could say no, but they could say yes. You know, it's you never really know unless you try things out. So I'm curious because you know, here Nikki and I are really into like creating our own little rituals or um ways of doing things that bring a little bit more meaning to it. I think just like how you spoke when you go into ceremony, where they, you know, say thank you to the ancestors, they say thank you to the people that have brought the kava. It's like it's a little moment of presence and gratitude before, you know, enjoying kava and partaking in this, in this wonderful time with each other, this community building. So, what would you say, maybe what have you done or what have you seen? What are some really good mindful ways to incorporate kava into uh maybe a weekly ritual or a daily ritual or something like that?

SPEAKER_02 1:01:10

Yeah. Um look, I got kids. I I've got a beautiful wife. We all love each other, but man, is it great when the house is quiet, it's late at night. You kind of you finally have 15 minutes to yourself. Uh, you know, for me, you know, the the kids are in bed. Uh you know, I'm just I'm just finally ready to do something that is is just for me. And um, you know, a lot of times I I talk to people that just say, well, I I don't have enough time. I I can't I can't take the time to prepare a kava. I can't take the time to do this. I think that's crazy. I think that you can take time for anything, and the thing that you should take time for is some time to decompress. You have to. If you don't do that, you're screwing yourself. You're just you're doing yourself a big, big disservice. So to me, the kids are in bed, the house is quiet, my wife is watching some terrible TV show that I don't want to watch. And I'm in the kitchen making my bowl of kava. And as you make kava, you put it in this bag and then you kind of massage the bag in the water, and it slowly releases the compounds into the water. And um, it takes five, ten minutes. To me, I turn off the TV, I turn off podcasts, it's just me in the bowl, and I'm making kava, and it is very meditative. It's a time where I can really think about like what is what's going on in my life, what happened today, what's going well, what's not, what should I be doing tomorrow? You know, it's all those questions where like, have you ever gotten into bed and you're like, I cannot fall asleep because I have every single thing in life hitting me right now when I'm trying to not have that happen? Was because you didn't wind down. You didn't take the time to prepare yourself to sleep. Uh, and I think that kava is the thing that helps me, you know, decompress and helps me sort of index my feelings and my emotions and my thoughts for the day. And then when I'm done preparing that kava, I'm ready to go. Okay, all right, I'm gonna drink some of this stuff. It's gonna make me feel pretty good. And then I can hit the hit, hit, hit, hit the sack later on and and and have a decent night's rest. It's not necessarily something that's gonna like, you know, fix you, like I said before, but it is something where it just helps you, you know, kind of just decompress and helps you arrange your your feelings and your thoughts. So the preparation of the kava to me is just as important as the actual drinking of it.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:53

I love that. I do, it's so funny. Everyone will be like, oh, I get in bed and my mind is just running. Because I mean, I used to experience that a lot. And I'm like, well, journaling for me, like me just like, you know, mind dumping, like you got to brain dump. The thing is, you're sitting there trying to make sure that you remember. You know, like, oh, I gotta remember to do that. Oh, I gotta remember to do that, I gotta remember, talk to that person to do this. And it's like, if you just get it out or like you take this moment, like you're saying, to think about all of these things and understand where you're gonna go later, then when you actually lay down, you can lay down. You don't have to try and remember. You don't have to try and do this, have to try and do that. Like you've already taken that moment. So I really love that you talk about the preparation is really like maybe more important, you know, or just as important as the actual drinking part of your ritual.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:47

Absolutely, it is. Absolutely. I I you know, you you can't like I I don't know. I I feel like all of the great things in life take time. And you know what I mean? Like you you can't skip the process. If you skip the process, you're losing out on all these things, you know. Man, I I okay, I had a I had a goal when I was when I was young. It didn't happen, by the way. Let's just, let's just, I did not hit this goal. Okay. When I was like 20 years old, I was like, I'm gonna be a millionaire by the time I'm 30. That did not happen. It still hasn't happened. I'm still, you know, still not doing that. But um, but I think that what I was missing back then was the wisdom to understand that the moment you will have a certain number of money, it doesn't change anything. And you, you know, you obviously you're gonna be a little bit more comfortable or whatever, but you in order to get to that, you had to do a lot. You had to, you have, you know, if you really are gonna make all that money or you're really gonna get to this point in life, you you have this this huge, high, lofty goal of oh, well, by the time I'm 30, I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna start a farm or I'm gonna do this or I'm gonna do that. You're forgetting about all of the things that happen in the middle. The process is just as important as the goal. You know, you have to do that. And and this is the same thing with kava. The process of making kava just as important as the kava itself. It doesn't, you know, you you can't have one with the other the other. You know, you can't have your cake and eat it too.

Where To Buy And Lab Testing

SPEAKER_01 1:06:24

Yeah, it's so true. Well, I'd love for our listeners to be able to connect with you easily or find, you know, good sources of kava, ethically sourced kava that doesn't have who knows what people add to things these days. So I would love to link those things in the show notes for you. But if you could share just a little bit about, you know, where people can connect with you and find out a little bit more about your company and um possibly try some.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:54

Yeah, so we're on all the different socials, Instagram and TikTok and YouTube uh at Calm with Kava. Uh it's Calm with a K. And um, you know, on our socials and our YouTube channel, we we talk a lot about education, about what Kava is and where it comes from. You know, you can see videos of it being farmed, you can see videos of the young plants, you can see videos of the old plants, you can see videos of the cultures that it comes from. Um, I show videos of when I go to Vanuatu and I'm out in the middle of nowhere talking to these folks. And um, you know, so it's just a very different sort of thing that you probably aren't used to. It's probably not in your Instagram algorithm, but I but I I think it's fascinating. I'm kind of like an anthropology sociology kind of nerd. So, and I love history and I love that kind of stuff. So, you know, if you if you're into that, you know, maybe maybe you guys would be into that too. But you can find us there on our socials and then uh our website is calmworthkava.com. You can also find our products on Amazon. Um what I would say is whether or not you buy from me, uh, look, I'm not here to like shill my products here. Um, but what I am here to do is is just to promote the good message of Kava. And so the thing that I would say is that regardless of where you buy your kava from, you should always make sure that it's lab tested, which means that it comes from, you know, you know, it's it's it's uh when the kava has been imported, it's you know, we're talking about areas of the world that don't have the best processing facilities, they don't have all the electricity we have, they don't have all the clean water we have. And so, you know, you you just really want to make sure that what you're ingesting is gonna be good for you, right? And so make sure that wherever you buy from has uh third-party accredited lab results just to make sure that you're ingesting all the good things and um and that you know what you're you're putting in your body. Um so that's that's uh that's it.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:41

Oh, I love that. Okay, good. Good tips and tricks. I love that. So I will make sure everyone to link all of those below. I'm super interested in the video side of it because I feel like, you know, this day and age, there's not a lot of transparency. And I feel like that is that creates so much transparency about how you operate your business, the relationship you build, like what goes into creating this end product that we're able to purchase. So I'm super curious in in checking those videos out. So I'll make sure to link the YouTube as well and everything for you. So uh again, Morgan, thank you so much for joining me today. This was an incredible and illuminating conversation, and I really enjoyed speaking with you. I haven't been able to talk to anyone who even understands anything about the culture out there in a long time. So this has been honestly like really wonderful for me too. So I really appreciate you getting up so early, you taking the time with me and us uh sharing this with everyone.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:44

Back at you. I really appreciate you having me on and and talking about this, you know, funky plant. It's awesome. Appreciate your time.

Final Thanks And Community Links

SPEAKER_01 1:09:52

Absolutely. Well, thanks again, guys, for staying until the end and check out the show notes for everything, and we'll see you next time. Thank you so much for spending time with us on the Modern Zen Collective Podcast. This podcast is at the heart of everything that we do, created to guide, inspire, and walk alongside you on your journey. If you're ready for more, explore our Practitioner Collective, a trusted resource of experts in healing and wellness to help you deepen your practice or fast-track transformation. And be sure to join our inout community to get first access to new offerings, challenges, and exclusive wisdom. You'll find all the links in the show notes. And until next time, keep trusting your past and honoring your unfolding.